Question Number: 13644

Law 8 - Start and Restart of Play 9/2/2006

RE: Rec Under 12

Frank of Omaha, NE USA asks...

This question is a follow up to question 13626

Follow up...
RE: Referee Chuck Fleischer - There I was, thinking that referee's weren't arrogant in their thinking... Bad me. I guess they don't ever make mistakes, and really don't like the obvious pointed out during the game when it could be corrected instantly. "..the referee's decisions regarding facts connected with play were final." - The facts connected with play included the opposing player being next to the goalie, my player being less than 10 yards past the center line. There were no ARs and I believe I yelled, "there's another defender".
RE: Referee Keith Contarino - "it's rare that a referee will change a call based on what a coach says" - I believe this is true, but the teams and the ref were all from the same club.

Answer provided by Referee Chuck Fleischer

So, we have just taught all the kids the referee's authority means nothing if a coach thinks or sees differently. The referee is right, right or wrong the referee is right. My answer and comments remain the same, what gives you the right to referee the match from the touchline? Is there something special I don't know?

It's an indirect free kick at, essentially, the halfway line, sheesh...

Answer provided by Referee Richard Dawson

Hi Frank,
if a referee is neutral and honest why can you not accept a mistake as part of the match conditions? The REASON a referee has final say is SOMEONE must when there are TWO opposed fractions involved! If you as Coach can point out a percieved error to a referee will you afford me the same luxury to switch your centre back to left mid and then instruct your left fullback to close down the hole until the mid drops back? Shall I scream at your striker to cut diagonally instead of those stupid square runs that has placed him offside 4 times this half? Coaches should coach they are not required to point out flaws obvious or otherwise to everyone in a middle of the match. How approachable tolerant or friendly a referee will recieve feedback is within the character of the individual and the attitudes and values that permeate the match

Arrogance is a trait not taught, it is a personal choice to victimize others.

A calm knowledgible referee does have the ability to reason , change a decision and accept limited dissent as a part of the match conditions. Coaches who like to point things out to a referee could be correct and a referee could accept their input. AS in all things of free will and choice not EVERYONE makes the same ones!

While watching a match, a coach whose team had scored on an OBVIOUSLY offside goal (the offside player potted a rebound after blocking the keeper line of sight on the original shot) and KNEW it to be simply applauded his team for doing so. About 15 minutes after the restart the opposing team broke in and scored a goal of their own to tie the match. This same coach screams to the referee and AR the player was offside and the goal should not count. He was in fact correct, the player had slipped in behind marginally and profited from an offside position.

Before we go into the ethical and moral portion lets examine the obviousness of both situations.

Would you approve if the referee said you are right he was offside no goal?

If the opposition have video of the first goal can we show it to the referee so he can take away the earlier goal? The one the coach did not comment on? Should a referee state, "well if you knew it was wrong you should have told me?"


When you pidgeon hole us for being intolerant or insensitive try remembering that writing a few words does not make a book nor a single action reflect the entirety of ones character. I believe a referee with integrity sees what he sees. If you are so unfortunate to have a referee who has none then nothing we say will matter as to why he made the choices he did. Those that defile the game or life in general answer to their conscience and whatever belief they subscribe too.

Coaches and players REQUIRE different things from a game, an outcome, an evolution of skill or tactical application, a victory be it outright in score or improvment on past performances that a referee has no SHARE in. The only thing a referee can share is in the concern for the welfare of the participants and a smile as they enjoy themselves. When I coach I approach the referee in the SAME manner I wish to be treated in every match. I praise effort, look for application of the laws and understanding of the game, seek through my captain the way the referee might wish us to ask for clarification in youth match otherwise, parents praise, team plays, I coach, he refs. I record the good along with (PERCIEVED) obvious defficencies and submit them to the league. I have spoken out in serious situtations but UNDERSTAND fully the ramifications and consequences when I did ! Cheers

Answer provided by Referee Ben Mueller

Mistakes will happen! Hopefully the mistakes will even out. It never helps to yell at a referee as that just matters worse. Believe me, referees know when they have had a bad game.

Answer provided by Referee Keith Contarino

Hi Frank. I believe I asked when the second opponent was on the line beside the keeper. If there were no ARs and I were the only referee, I would be ignoring anything coming from either sideline. Why? Because it's hard enough to take in everything going on without listening for coach or fan comments. Even if the teams and ref are all familiar with each other, the referee calls the game. If I turn my head to look at you, I'm liable to miss something important. You may be correct. You may be wrong. If you're yelling directions to me, I'm not paying attention unless I hear something involving player safety. If I don't see a U12 player down I hope the coach would yell at me. but as far as offside, direction of throws, fouls I'm out there doing the best I can and your advice will be ignored unless it gets to the point you are interferring with the game and then we'll probably have a little chat. Ref Dawson rightly points out that for some inexplicable reason, coaches feel it's their inherent right to question and dispute calls but if a referee ever behaved that way he'd be castigated. There have been many, many games where I just wanted to scream at a coach for how he had his players positioned or to stop trying an offside trap because it wasn't working or a number of other things. But what you guys do as far as coaching is concerned is none of my business unless you are actively telling your players to hurt an opponent. Again, I'll intervene if player safety is an issue. All referees make mistakes as do all players and all coaches. Part of the game. We don't point out yours and you shouldn't point out ours. I'd also remind you that referees are neutral. Coaches, players, and fans are not. What you and the referee see may be very different. Stick to what the Law tells us. Coaches are to give tactical advice to their players. That's it. Doesn't mean we're arrogant or never admit mistakes.

The following questions were asked as a follow up to the above question...

See Question: 13691